Eastman / Aero price gouging on overseas sales

[Jeff M]

This can be settled quite quickly, does any foreign Eastman customer have a receipt from Eastman, if so, what does it actualy say on it? Foreiign as in non UK / EU.

To answer this question (which may have been answered somewhere in this thread already.....but I didn't see it)
I just received the ELC receipt by mail for the A1 I purchased last week and have sent back.
The cost of the jacket listed on the ELC web site..... £ 624.99

Receipt shows; "A1 Cape.......£ 624.99
"Shipping..........£ 40.00
"Total............£ 664.99"

No VAT amount indicated in the total.
None deducted.

 

[arclight]

That's a darn shame Jeff. It would have been nice to share that with the guys over at the Hat lounge..........but alas, the thread has been shut down by the mods.

 

[ButteMT61]

That's a darn shame Jeff. It would have been nice to share that with the guys over at the Hat lounge..........but alas, the thread has been shut down by the mods.

I look at it this way, we should be helping our Allies due to the empty seats at the Olympic stadium. I've done my part :lol:

 

[Jaguar46]

So Jaguar46.....you and I catch the same flight to London to buy the same new Jaguar cars for export to the States. I know that probably is not possible buying North American spec cars without going through a Jag dealer in the U.S. but saying that it was. I buy mine from a dealer in Birmingham and, keeping with the spirit of the VAT, does not charge me the Value Added Tax. Your London dealer charges you the VAT. You wouldn't feel like you were being slighted? Is this "fair" to you?

You assume in this scenario, that you and I pay the same final price, correct? Its the final price that I pay that matters to me. If the Jaguar in Birmingham is less than the one I would buy in the US I win. We are assuming many things here, so I will assume that is why I came to England in the first place. And you win, since I assume you negotiated for the best price you could get. (unless you negotiate for a better price from the dealer in Coventry, which is where my car was made). And why didn't I buy a Ferrari from Italy? Because a 1966 Ferrari GTS costs a lot more. And the markup on a Ferrari is a lot more to begin with. (supply and demand plays a role here, also) The Jaguar is an incredible value for the price. If the London dealer makes more off me than you, well, thats the game, and if I want to play, I have to pay.

Now if you are another customer from my neighborhood, and the same dealer says, he will discount the car 20% to you, because he (the dealer) doesn't have to pay the VAT on cars sold to US customers, then I would get a little steamed.

As it is, I bought the car used in 1974 from a colleague I was in training with. He sold it to me for $600. I considered it a great buy even then.

 

[watchmanjimg]

As it is, I bought the car used in 1974 from a colleague I was in training with. He sold it to me for $600. I considered it a great buy even then.

You had to rub it in, didn't you?

 

[ButteMT61]

So Jaguar46.....you and I catch the same flight to London to buy the same new Jaguar cars for export to the States. I know that probably is not possible buying North American spec cars without going through a Jag dealer in the U.S. but saying that it was. I buy mine from a dealer in Birmingham and, keeping with the spirit of the VAT, does not charge me the Value Added Tax. Your London dealer charges you the VAT. You wouldn't feel like you were being slighted? Is this "fair" to you?

You assume in this scenario, that you and I pay the same final price, correct? Its the final price that I pay that matters to me. If the Jaguar in Birmingham is less than the one I would buy in the US I win. We are assuming many things here, so I will assume that is why I came to England in the first place. And you win, since I assume you negotiated for the best price you could get. (unless you negotiate for a better price from the dealer in Coventry, which is where my car was made). And why didn't I buy a Ferrari from Italy? Because a 1966 Ferrari GTS costs a lot more. And the markup on a Ferrari is a lot more to begin with. (supply and demand plays a role here, also) The Jaguar is an incredible value for the price. If the London dealer makes more off me than you, well, thats the game, and if I want to play, I have to pay.

Now if you are another customer from my neighborhood, and the same dealer says, he will discount the car 20% to you, because he (the dealer) doesn't have to pay the VAT on cars sold to US customers, then I would get a little steamed.

As it is, I bought the car used in 1974 from a colleague I was in training with. He sold it to me for $600. I considered it a great buy even then.

With all due respect, none of these what-if variables mean squat to the issue that has folks upset. But again I think we've reached the impasse that got us this many pages.
Anyone happy with the situation can and should Keep Calm & Carry On. Those unhappy may go elsewhere, which I've already seen happening. Maybe not enough that anyone cares, but...

 

[Otter]

This can be settled quite quickly, does any foreign Eastman customer have a receipt from Eastman, if so, what does it actualy say on it? Foreiign as in non UK / EU.

To answer this question (which may have been answered somewhere in this thread already.....but I didn't see it)
I just received the ELC receipt by mail for the A1 I purchased last week and have sent back.
The cost of the jacket listed on the ELC web site..... £ 624.99

Receipt shows; "A1 Cape.......£ 624.99
"Shipping..........£ 40.00
"Total............£ 664.99"

No VAT amount indicated in the total.
None deducted.

Ah ha! The Smoking Gnu! :lol:

 

[Jaguar46]

With all due respect, none of these what-if variables mean squat to the issue that has folks upset. But again I think we've reached the impasse that got us this many pages.
Anyone happy with the situation can and should Keep Calm & Carry On. Those unhappy may go elsewhere, which I've already seen happening. Maybe not enough that anyone cares, but...

With all due respect, if my vote had any effect, I would vote for this thread to come to end.

 

[Jeff M]

With all due respect, none of these what-if variables mean squat to the issue that has folks upset. But again I think we've reached the impasse that got us this many pages.
Anyone happy with the situation can and should Keep Calm & Carry On. Those unhappy may go elsewhere, which I've already seen happening. Maybe not enough that anyone cares, but...

With all due respect, if my vote had any effect, I would vote for this thread to come to end.

Hopefully...not.
It will eventually fade away from the front page.

 

[ButteMT61]

With all due respect, none of these what-if variables mean squat to the issue that has folks upset. But again I think we've reached the impasse that got us this many pages.
Anyone happy with the situation can and should Keep Calm & Carry On. Those unhappy may go elsewhere, which I've already seen happening. Maybe not enough that anyone cares, but...

With all due respect, if my vote had any effect, I would vote for this thread to come to end.

Odd, it did then you bumped it up again?

 

[Jeff M]

Yep.
If tired of all the yapping it's best to just let those sleeping dogs lie. :lol:

 

[omarco]

personlly i'm happy to let it keep rolling, anyone who doesn't already understand just needs to read the thread through for a pretty clear idea of whats going on

for those just skipping to the end for a quick update - the revelation is that it will cost you the same to buy the jacket in the US or the UK but that the manufacturer will probably take a little more profit if you buy from the US.

 

[Persimmon]

personlly i'm happy to let it keep rolling, anyone who doesn't already understand just needs to read the thread through for a pretty clear idea of whats going on

for those just skipping to the end for a quick update - the revelation is that it will cost you the same to buy the jacket in the US or the UK but that the manufacturer will probably take a little more profit if you buy from the US.

Or another way of looking at it, if one's wants a quick update is that

For years Aero and Eastman have been overcharging their overseas customers who reside in non European countries by charging the VAT element of 20% (formely 17.5%) which they are not required to do.

They are choosing to take extra margin from these overseas customers without making it clear on their websites for several reasons that include to subsidize their home markets, (Yeah Right !!) , keep "special friends" happy with better discounts and because many overseas customer's jackets need more material (because they are Fat it appears !!)

So now you have a choice continue to purchase or not, but at least the real costs are there to be seen and after all it was the clarity issue forum members were after

 

[omarco]

personally i think my quick update was snappier

and besides the REAL costs as you put it have been published on the website since its existence. This issue really has nothing whatsoever to do with VAT.

 

[Persimmon]

personally i think my quick update was snappier

and besides the REAL costs as you put it have been published on the website since its existence. This issue really has nothing whatsoever to do with VAT.

Yours was shorter certainly but for someone to just scroll to the end of a thread I hope mine was more informative

The "Real Costs" as you put it are now known to members rather than just a cost stated on their website.

The issue was clarity based on a VAT issue so ...sorry have to disagree completly with your statement.

Still it was short, and I will give you a bonus mark for that !!

 

[omarco]

Yours was shorter certainly but for someone to just scroll to the end of a thread I hope mine was more informative

The "Real Costs" as you put it are now known to members rather than just a cost stated on their website.

personally i think yours was a little too emotive to be informative.

I think its safe to say that we have no idea of the real costs to the manufacturer, certainly no more so than we did before the 'revelations'.

What we do know is the cost to the customer, and i'm pleased to say it is the same wherever you live. To say ELC and Aero are charging VAT to US customers is just plain old wrong.

 

[Persimmon]

Yours was shorter certainly but for someone to just scroll to the end of a thread I hope mine was more informative

The "Real Costs" as you put it are now known to members rather than just a cost stated on their website.

personally i think yours was a little too emotive to be informative.

I think its safe to say that we have no idea of the real costs to the manufacturer, certainly no more so than we did before the 'revelations'.

What we do know is the cost to the customer, and i'm pleased to say it is the same wherever you live. To say ELC and Aero are charging VAT to US customers is just plain old wrong.[/quote]


Goodness
ELC and AERO are indeed NOT charging VAT to their overseas customers,
That is what is being said.
They are just charging the same price and taking the extra profit and after being challenged about the practise offered Flip Flam excuses rather than be open about the issue.

Perhaps you really need to read the whole thread !!!

 

[omarco]

They are just charging the same price and taking the extra profit and after being challenged about the practise offered Flip Flam excuses rather than be open about the issue.

Perhaps you really need to read the whole thread !!!

I haven't seen the 'flip flam' excuses on the issue (but have indeed read the whole thread) but i refer you back to my previous summary which is just about exactly what you yourself have just stated above:

The 'revelation' here is that it will cost you the same to buy the jacket in the US or the UK but that the manufacturer will probably take a little more profit if you buy from the US.

The 'truth' that you are seeking is in the bottom line for the customer (which is the same irrespective of the continent on which you happen to live). I don't see the need for any company to explain to me what their margins are, i honestly couldn't care less. If i don't like the price i don't buy! Anyone who felt the price was okay before but not now should not spend their money there... but it seems to me that thats a bit daft.

 

[Dr H]

The Flim Flam as Alan put it is on the curtailed FL thread.

 

[Persimmon]

They are just charging the same price and taking the extra profit and after being challenged about the practise offered Flip Flam excuses rather than be open about the issue.

Perhaps you really need to read the whole thread !!!

I haven't seen the 'flip flam' excuses on the issue (but have indeed read the whole thread) but i refer you back to my previous summary which is just about exactly what you yourself have just stated above:

The 'revelation' here is that it will cost you the same to buy the jacket in the US or the UK but that the manufacturer will probably take a little more profit if you buy from the US.

The 'truth' that you are seeking is in the bottom line for the customer (which is the same irrespective of the continent on which you happen to live). I don't see the need for any company to explain to me what their margins are, i honestly couldn't care less. If i don't like the price i don't buy! Anyone who felt the price was okay before but not now should not spend their money there... but it seems to me that thats a bit daft.

Now you would say that wouldn't you
Crazy !!