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Some of the 4th FG and a lot of A-2s
- Thread starter Smithy
- Start date
Pa12
Well-Known Member
Much like some of us
Pa12
Well-Known Member
Also, because of the price of heating fuel this year, we’re keeping the thermostat down a couple degrees from what we used to. So, instead of donning a perry como cardigan, I wear my a-2 in the house most of the day.
Micawber
Well-Known Member
Which ever jacket I’m wearing, I don’t hang it up at the end of the day. I scrunch it up in a ball and put it on the kitchen chair. It’s softening up my Platon and giving it lots of character. Pisses the wife off though.
That's the way to treat 'em. This has been discussed ad nauseam here and elsewhere but I am often left with the impression quite a few people are actually frightened to wear / treat repro A-2's in the same manner as most originals were back in what were the rather busy and hectic war years. Treat them like work garments, actually wear the damned things while doing stuff and not just for posing and looking pretty / immaculate.
Smithy
Well-Known Member
This.
Steve is so right and on the money. Wear them like they were meant to be worn.
If you stop treating them like something to be fretted about and wear them hard they'll look all the better for the use.
It's just a leather jacket, wear it like it was meant to be worn, the harder the better because it'll look better for it.
flyincowboy
Well-Known Member
Just one thing not to forget feed the leather with a good cream product once a year. it will keep the leather supple and flexible.
Flightengineer
Well-Known Member
Much depends on the thickness of the leather. My second Platon Dubow made of thin, lighter and more pliable leather and weighs 200 grams lighter than the first one. It's draped like a WW2 jacket from first day.
B-Man2
Well-Known Member
Ive always thought that the reason WWII jackets draped so nicely is that they were issued a bit larger than we wear them . I mean many of us here like that trim look but as I’ve pointed out in the past, look at what WWII crews wore under their A2’s. Undershirt , long underwear, a wool shirt , a sweater , sometime a flight suit. Hell no wonder the jackets always looked trim . Then in better weather conditions with half of that clothing off and just a wool shirt underneath and they drape on the wearer. Well of course they do because of the extra room. Look at the pilots when they’re just wearing a shirt and the jacket look a bit large on them. We tend to order jackets so trim that a tee shirt is all that can be worn. And by the way if you want your A2 to look like theirs did then As we’ve said so many times “Wear the piss out of them!”.
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Pa12
Well-Known Member
And stay thin. Very thin.Ive always thought that the reason WWII jackets draped so nicely is that they were issued a bit larger than we wear them . I mean many of us here like that trim look but as I’ve pointed out in the past, look at what WWII crews wore under their A2’s. Undershirt , long underwear, a wool shirt , a sweater , sometime a flight suit. Hell no wonder the jackets always looked trim . Then in better weather conditions with half of that clothing off and just a wool shirt underneath and they drape on the wearer. Well of course they do because of the extra room. Look at the pilots when they’re just wearing a shirt and the jacket look a bit large on them. We tend to order jackets so trim that a tee shirt is all that can be worn. And by the way if you want your A2 to look like theirs did then As we’ve said so many times “Wear the piss out of them!”.
Smithy
Well-Known Member
Ive always thought that the reason WWII jackets draped so nicely is that they were issued a bit larger than we wear them . I mean many of us here like that trim look but as I’ve pointed out in the past, look at what WWII crews wore under their A2’s. Undershirt , long underwear, a wool shirt , a sweater , sometime a flight suit. Hell no wonder the jackets always looked trim . Then in better weather conditions with half of that clothing off and just a wool shirt underneath and they drape on the wearer. Well of course they do because of the extra room. Look at the pilots when they’re just wearing a shirt and the jacket look a bit large on them. We tend to order jackets so trim that a tee shirt is all that can be worn. And by the way if you want your A2 to look like theirs did then As we’ve said so many times “Wear the piss out of them!”.
I think size has a part to play Burt but the photographic evidence points to the originals having a very soft drape when they were new, and I'd argue that it's a softer drape than the majority of repros have. That class photo I posted a couple of pages back is the perfect example.
TBH though chasing the "perfect" repro is like chasing the pot at the end of the rainbow - it's actually unattainable due to the simple fact that no jacket today can ever be a 100% facsimile of one from the war and especially due to the fact tanning methods have changed.
I just like how those originals draped so buttery soft in period images ;-)
Smithy
Well-Known Member
Dude of the Day...
2Lt. Robert Boock of Springfield, Ill. of 334 Sqn. He was a former Eagle with 71 Sqn but was sadly shot down and KIA 18 May 1943 in this same P-47C "Old Red Ass".
Here he is with his armourer Sgt. Larry Hendel.
Re Boock's "Old Red Ass".
It was the 4th's famous artist Don Allen who painted the nose art. Back in the early 90s Don repainted versions of some of the most famous nose art he had done in the 4th and "Old Red Ass" was among them. Most are included in Frank Speer's (who also flew with the 4th) book "The Debden Warbirds". Here's Don's later redoing of "Old Red Ass"...
ZuZu
Well-Known Member
Part of that is I think the Legend of Veg Tanned Leather- I think most WW2 jackets were made with chrome tanned leather- floppy and giving. Some modern leather is close- Horween for instance- but I think it's impossible to get that beautiful leather anymore- the modern leather is just fucked with too much. I have seen leather from Mexico and other countries which looks pretty close- I think it's hard to find by your little repro shops,
That being said- I think a lot of the reason the jackets don't drape the same is well- you guys! You want jackets that are trim fitting and "bespoke" looking. We modern people just aren't built the same as WW2 guys. I am 1" shorter than my father who was 6'1" and weighed about 145 all his life. He wore a 40 everything all his life. I'm as skinny as he was- just much bigger framed. So to get a true WW2 looking A-2 I need a real 46. We've had the WW2 fit discussion 1 billion times- but in real life it's quite simple- they wore bigger jackets which fit their smaller frames.
I went through literally the whole "What Jacket Are You..." thread and I find that there are some repros that look right- mostly on old guys who wear a big jacket. Then you get the drape...
Pa12
Well-Known Member
Most of them look baggier around the belly. Probably indicative of how our waistlines have “blossomed “. I remember my mum telling me that my dad wore a 28 waist when they got married. Not since I was 13 could I fit in a pair of 28’s.
Flightengineer
Well-Known Member
ZuZu and Burt are both 1000% right, they were very young and mostly very skinny guys (" these are no longer made"(c) - the world has changed irrevocably) who wore layers under these jackets. We will never be able to look like them and this is also a fact. May be а bit similar, but exactly the same - never.
On the topic of the thread - Tim, did the art with the monkey mean that the crews had very big flight hrs load "sitting" their asses in the cockpits, or was there some other meaning?
On the topic of the thread - Tim, did the art with the monkey mean that the crews had very big flight hrs load "sitting" their asses in the cockpits, or was there some other meaning?
Smithy
Well-Known Member
Dmitry, I had a quick look in both of Speer's books which have nose art appendices and whilst showing Old Red Ass there was unfortunately no explanation of why Boock chose that moniker for his ship.
Brettafett
Well-Known Member
Would love to see more of this!
B-Man2
Well-Known Member
Guys
I’m guessing his choice of “Old Red Ass” had something to do with him sending a message to the enemy to kiss his ass.
blackrat2
Well-Known Member
Gonna say, the Horween I have on my Poughkeepsie is certainly nice and soft and I certainly buck the trend when it comes to trim jackets, have alway preferred a loose fit with room to layer
There is a few now who have Horween leather from John, be interested if they think the same or if fortunate maybe can compare a Horween A2 next to Shinki or Italian leather which I think might be veg tanned?!
There is a few now who have Horween leather from John, be interested if they think the same or if fortunate maybe can compare a Horween A2 next to Shinki or Italian leather which I think might be veg tanned?!
