Anything and Everything A-1

[zoomer]

I've read through this entire thread, but I still don't have a clear understanding of the A-1's collar variations. I thought I'd read that the navy versions used the lower profile, one button version, but obviously these are the high profile two button collars.

I had thought the Navy collar was a no-button, varsity type that curved down in front, exposing the neck for scarf wear.

Notice the offset buttons on Curly's jacket. What could that be for?

That takes up the slack if your collar fits loosely. The lower button stays put to keep the leather from buckling. I did it myself - it works!

Paul, did you identify the source for the original purchase order, specifying the chocolate brown color? I'd like to research the history of this jacket more.

You may have to learn Japanese and buy Full Gear. There is nearly zero interest in the West in the pre-WW2 stuff, outside of a few web forums like this one. It was horribly scarce to begin with, and practically all of it went to Japan before anyone here even knew about it.

As for me, I have never seen the purchase order and don't know a thing about it. Sure would like to though.

 

[deeb7]

Deeb, if you look closely at the collar buttons on Curly's jacket, you'll see that the bottom button is set much closer to the shoulder than the top one. Normally, the buttons are perpendicular rather than set in a diagonal.

Oh yes, I see ... I don't know what's going on there.

Regarding its being an AAF jacket, it does have the high pockets, which I thought was a Navy pattern. Too, the USS Akron was a navy airship. So, perhaps I am wrong about the high pockets being a Navy pattern?

I have just looked at the AAF type collar, and misidentified the jacket ... yes, it is a 37J1. The high pockets are stipulated in the specs, but unless there's a second page, the collar fastening isn't mentioned. Looking at the few available photos, a single button is usual, or a single press stud.

 

[Tokyo Jones]

I've read through this entire thread, but I still don't have a clear understanding of the A-1's collar variations. I thought I'd read that the navy versions used the lower profile, one button version, but obviously these are the high profile two button collars.

I had thought the Navy collar was a no-button, varsity type that curved down in front, exposing the neck for scarf wear.

I wonder if the varsity collar was job specific. It doesn't seem intuitive that such a short collar would be particularly effective as a flight jacket in an open cockpit Goshawk, for instance.

Notice the offset buttons on Curly's jacket. What could that be for?

That takes up the slack if your collar fits loosely. The lower button stays put to keep the leather from buckling. I did it myself - it works!

Awesome! That's obviously the kind of detail that only someone who'd worn the jacket would know.

Paul, did you identify the source for the original purchase order, specifying the chocolate brown color? I'd like to research the history of this jacket more.

You may have to learn Japanese and buy Full Gear. There is nearly zero interest in the West in the pre-WW2 stuff, outside of a few web forums like this one. It was horribly scarce to begin with, and practically all of it went to Japan before anyone here even knew about it.

As for me, I have never seen the purchase order and don't know a thing about it. Sure would like to though.

One thing that led me to ask the question was the assertion on ELC's website, which states that the initial contract called for olive drab. I wonder if it's possible that the contract changed, and if so, when? It's a pity this information isn't more widely available in English, and while I am (slowly and fitfully) studying Japanese, perhaps it would be possible to chase down the original contracts through the US Navy. I think I may look into that...

Thanks!
TJ

 

[deeb7]

One thing that led me to ask the question was the assertion on ELC's website, which states that the initial contract called for olive drab. I wonder if it's possible that the contract changed, and if so, when? It's a pity this information isn't more widely available in English, and while I am (slowly and fitfully) studying Japanese, perhaps it would be possible to chase down the original contracts through the US Navy. I think I may look into that...

The O.D. color reference is from the circa 1950 Wright Field Type Designation Sheet, reproduced in Sweeting's Combat Flying Clothing. I haven't seen it recorded anywhere else, and no one seems to have seen one.

The 1927 USN specifications for the 37J1, reproduced in Full Gear state "best quality chrome tanned sheepskin, the color of which shall be chocolate".

 

[zoomer]

Lieut. Odas Moon and Keystone Panther crew, who sham-bombed New York City in a night exercise May 21, 1929.
L-R, they are Lieuts. Charles T. Skow (radioman), Moon (pilot), Eugene L. Eubank (copilot), and John P. Richter (observer and refueler). The Keystone also carried a civilian navigator (the Army Air Corps did not yet train navigators as such).

This is one of the best group photos I have found of airmen using the A-1 jacket. Each wears the early variant with waist buttons (no snaps), layered over V-neck sweaters. The well-used A-1s show the distinctive graining and stretch of capeskin and the button front's tendency to gap.

The pic is notable as well for the achievements of these pilots. "Odie" Moon had piloted a tanker plane as part of the marathon Question Mark flight earlier in '29 – an operation apparently repeated on this May flight. He was an early strategic bombing instructor before alcoholism led to his grounding and premature death in 1937, at the rank of major.

Charles Skow had flown in the first crop-dusting experiments earlier in the '20s. Gene Eubank, a fellow bombing instructor of Moon's and later CO of the 19th Bomb Group, is remembered for introducing the 1943 film Bombardier. John Richter, in 1923, had been the first ever to refuel an airplane in flight.
__________________

 

[deeb7]

Note that the A-1 at that time had no snaps.

... and the repositioned collar button makes another appearance.

Good picture.

 

[Tokyo Jones]

Great, now I have to get a leather flight helmet and integrate a set of AKG 701s into it. Do you think he's got an iPod in his pocket?

 

[zoomer]

If he has, it's got vacuum tubes and it's playing Red Nichols and His Five Pennies.

 

[asiamiles]

... and the repositioned collar button makes another appearance.

Presumably there's just a single loop and the second button would be used if the neck needed fastening tighter?

 

[Weasel_Loader]

Great photo Zoomer.

As to the question mark flight, I remember seeing a photo of one of the aircrew of that flight wearing an A-1 with a big question mark painted on the front left chest. Kind of unique to do for one flight.

 

[zoomer]

Sure would like to see that pic.
I know Hap Arnold's Alaska crews in '34 got all new Werber 1729s with a special crest (and noticeably oversized fit too, perhaps for layering in the northern climes). So anything was possible.

 

[Tokyo Jones]

If he has, it's got vacuum tubes and it's playing Red Nichols and His Five Pennies.

I can't believe it's taken me this long to check out Red Nichols, but man that guy is gone! Real gone! I might be ossified on that ol' strike-me-dead, but I ain't such a rummy that I cain't get a wiggle on with that jive, Jackson!

But seriously, I loved it.

 

[Weasel_Loader]

Notice that Hap and only a few others have their collars snapped? I guess from the very beginning, most didn't prefer the collars snapped.

 

[ausreenactor]

Gents..

My foray or 'forA-1' commenced today. Had the LW A-1 arrive an hour ago, with a BR 42 Tanker and 40 M-41 from the first run years ago.

Collar buttons have been removed, with a slight knick to the inner knit. Waist and cuff knits perfect. Super fit and I could bulk around
the waist even more!! For a 40 it is pretty roomy. Very impressed with it. There are no rear sleeve seams, so am I not sure how accurate
the pattern is. Super grain in parts. Very happy A-1 owner.

Excuse the beard. It is a must on leave...for the other 50 weeks of the year it is not allowed. And Deeb carries the A-1/beard combo
so well!!

Couchy

 

[deeb7]

Excuse the beard. It is a must on leave...for the other 50 weeks of the year it is not allowed. And Deeb carries the A-1/beard combo so well!!

........ I heard that !!

That LW's great, Couchy ... good colour, good fit, and the sleeves look fine. Remember the one with the playing cards painted on the chest, that Senicko posted on the old forum? Same colour, but the sleeves were way too long for him, and like drain pipes, with no taper at all.

 

[bseal]

OD A-1 Group Buy

 

[zoomer]

1. Beautiful...whether any were made that way in 1927 or not!

2. That's twice you've posted the pix without any further info. What up with that?

 

[bseal]

And I thought you prided yourself on your powers of ratiocination and astute deduction.

Capeskin: a firm, washable leather used esp. for gloves, originally made from the skin of goats from the Cape of Good Hope, but now from hairy lambskin or sheepskin.

 

[zoomer]

That's dated 1939, btw...it's entirely possible that whoever compiled that list had never actually seen an A-1. :geek:

 

[deand]

Aero, or Good Wear. :|







dean