Gary's famous

[flyboy]

+ 1 - me too!!!!

 

[a2jacketpatches]

I think the only other time you may be able to group me in with members trying to shut down an Eastman thread rather than discuss it was when the Umbriago jacket came out. As an artist who actually knows how to use paint along with what is involved with the execution of artwork, I did feel the need to step in and clear a few things up for the those non artist critics. There was some blah blah I could do that kind of "bullony", and blah blah it's too expensive kind of "Bullsh*t" It wasn't my love for Eastman, it was for my fellow artists that take the time (years) and effort to learn their materials and methods so that other can sit back for years and enjoy it. Just couldn't let all that blah blah go on. So I think that's where I was coming in my first two posts here. I didn't see anything else in this thread the least bit relevant to the following -

"There's lots of PM's flying, that's for sure.
For those of us who don't know Gary, we rely upon info posted here and on other forums. Some of you get all defensive when someone dares challenge ELC. Fine, but those who don't know don't know who is telling the truth, do we? Some smart, good, respectable folks disagree with you. OK, now what? I read opinions from many. I get PM's from many. Doesn't resolve anything for me (and likely others).
I have nothing against either the man or the company, but I've read some interesting threads here, and dislike people trying to shut them down as opposed to just discussing the subject.
People like to chant how maker "X" isn't accurate. Everyone just accepts this as gospel. Bunk. If someone is going to say it, say why. That Aero (or anyone else) doesn't make an accurate jacket gets said over and over. Tell us why."

OK?

 

[Anonymous]

I personally don't like the Umbriago jacket painting and I am not an artist.
But I have a little experience with painting (not jackets) and jacket making so I can understand how difficult it is to make.
The painting itself may not mean anything to you, or could be indeed overpriced.
But the effort, skill and amount of precision required to make the painting aged so realistically,
that alone my friends, worths the money.

 

[Anonymous]

:roll:

 

[a2jacketpatches]

I personally don't like the Umbriago jacket painting and I am not an artist.
But I have a little experience with painting (not jackets) and jacket making so I can understand how difficult it is to make.
The painting itself may not mean anything to you, or could be indeed overpriced.
But the effort, skill and amount of precision required to make the painting aged so realistically,
that alone my friends, worths the money.

Yes, whoever did it meant it that way, the aged look to it wasn't an accident like some feeble attempt by a coloring book artist. :lol: I'm sure Gary pays a good sum for each painted jacket, it certainly is no $24.oo paint job.

I have no experience driving a truck for a living but can understand that I don't know everything involved and would never criticize it.

 

[Steve27752]

Gary's very smart and does his job very well.
I must congratulate him for being a pioneer. His jackets are excellent despite the little flaws.
If it wasn't for Gary we would be wearing Avirex (the luckiest among us would, the others would wear Cockpit or USWings).
I think Gary is one of the founding fathers of repro making and he should be respected for that. He went the extra mile.
He is still number one in providing Crown and Kwik zippers. Many repro makers are still behind him e.g. Aero is a brand that makes good solid and tough jackets, but I would not say accurate repro making is their business.

Gary is still #1 (numero uno) in Europe, I don't think anyone can doubt that. Even is someone else appears that can make a more accurate/better A-2 than Gary, Gary has so large range of products that will still be no 1.

Well said Platon.

 

[Roughwear]

Gary's very smart and does his job very well.
I must congratulate him for being a pioneer. His jackets are excellent despite the little flaws.
If it wasn't for Gary we would be wearing Avirex (the luckiest among us would, the others would wear Cockpit or USWings).
I think Gary is one of the founding fathers of repro making and he should be respected for that. He went the extra mile.
He is still number one in providing Crown and Kwik zippers. Many repro makers are still behind him e.g. Aero is a brand that makes good solid and tough jackets, but I would not say accurate repro making is their business.

Gary is still #1 (numero uno) in Europe, I don't think anyone can doubt that. Even is someone else appears that can make a more accurate/better A-2 than Gary, Gary has so large range of products that will still be no 1.

I also agree with this and judging by the vast numbers who pack out the Eastman mobile shop at Duxford airshows many others would too.

 

[Roughwear]

That Aero (or anyone else) doesn't make an accurate jacket gets said over and over. Tell us why.
Tell us why ELC jackets are better.

Time and time again it has been argued on this forum that whilst Aero makes fantastic civi jackets their military jackets are not as historically accurate as Eastman's jackets. Quite simply Aero do not get as many of the details correct as ELC does.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes,
It seems that it's not that Aero can't but just don't want to bother.
They are no 1 in the civilian styles and that their weapon.

 

[ButteMT61]

Gary's very smart and does his job very well.
I must congratulate him for being a pioneer. His jackets are excellent despite the little flaws.
If it wasn't for Gary we would be wearing Avirex (the luckiest among us would, the others would wear Cockpit or USWings).
I think Gary is one of the founding fathers of repro making and he should be respected for that. He went the extra mile.
He is still number one in providing Crown and Kwik zippers. Many repro makers are still behind him e.g. Aero is a brand that makes good solid and tough jackets, but I would not say accurate repro making is their business.

Gary is still #1 (numero uno) in Europe, I don't think anyone can doubt that. Even is someone else appears that can make a more accurate/better A-2 than Gary, Gary has so large range of products that will still be no 1.

I also agree with this and judging by the vast numbers who pack out the Eastman mobile shop at Duxford airshows many others would too.

The effects of this forum on any maker are nil at best. That's why I don't take it too seriously. Those here are probably 98% set on liking or not liking brand X anyway. It's just a place to blow off steam and share and otherwise be a little more rambunctious than The Hat Place™ or others.
I'd be shocked if any jacket maker lost more than three sales because of anything said here...

 

[flyboy]

[/quote]
The effects of this forum on any maker are nil at best. That's why I don't take it too seriously. Those here are probably 98% set on liking or not liking brand X anyway. It's just a place to blow off steam and share and otherwise be a little more rambunctious than The Hat Place™ or others.
I'd be shocked if any jacket maker lost more than three sales because of anything said here...[/quote]

I think you better be ready for some shocks then. Both "the Hat Forum" and this forum is used by "newcommers" to chek out different repro makers - and I think many decisions are made from remarks or valued information. I know I did. Twice. So only one more - and you are shocked!

 

[ButteMT61]

The effects of this forum on any maker are nil at best. That's why I don't take it too seriously. Those here are probably 98% set on liking or not liking brand X anyway. It's just a place to blow off steam and share and otherwise be a little more rambunctious than The Hat Place™ or others.
I'd be shocked if any jacket maker lost more than three sales because of anything said here...

I think you better be ready for some shocks then. Both "the Hat Forum" and this forum is used by "newcommers" to chek out different repro makers - and I think many decisions are made from remarks or valued information. I know I did. Twice. So only one more - and you are shocked!

OK, what if I decide to buy an ELC Redskin B-6, do I get one back? :lol:
I believe that more on TFL than here. It's more work to get in here, and many say they won't bother.

 

[a2jacketpatches]

Several times per month when a guy is asking about a custom patch, name tag, or artwork, he'll ask if there's a jacket maker that I recommend. It's as simple as this for me and everyone else in the world for the most part, you get what you pay for.

I would typically say something like this -

Goodwear and Eastman are top of the line and make super accurate reproductions, Bill kelso also makes an excellent jacket at very reasonable price. And I would leave it at that. FYI, my opinions of these companies are based on facts AND because I have business ties with all three.

Another thing, I have sent many new enthusiasts from countries all over the world to this forum to learn more about flight jackets, you may not hear from many of them due to a language barrier, it is sometimes very hard for me to comm with them, but I chit you not, they are here. I know for a fact that I am a direct influence at least for those who find my patches before buying a jacket and that happens more than you'd know. Fact gentlemen, fact. So don't underestimate the power of WORD of MOUTH. It is very strong. And when I send a jacket seeker with deep pockets here that has limited info or just a newbie looking for guidance, everything that is said here may be all the guy knows when he buys his jacket. So don't fool yourselves.

I also sent who is now a very good friend of mine here after promoting him a little bit. We will soon have a type of patch making partnership and share a website. Well, I was a bit embarrassed for him as I watched a bunch of loose cannons carelessly shoot their mouths off. Shortly after that he joined up. He doesn't say much here and I don't blame him. I'll leave it at that.

 

[SuinBruin]

The forum isn't for everyone, that's for sure. There's more than enough BS here to go around -- most of it good-natured, some of it not. Luckily it's all leavened by healthy doses of humor and quality information, if you can discern the wheat from the chaff.

This isn't the thread for Eastman-bashing. Their products are what they are. If you have one and like it, more power to you. If you see one and want it, then by all means go for it. My issues with Eastman have to do with certain of their business practices. Some are troubled by these; some aren't. Everyone is free to make up his own mind and to speak his piece. Vive la difference.

 

[ausreenactor]

Vive la difference.

Trés bien dit!!

Couchy!

 

[John Lever]

Gary's favourite business practice for me is a 3 week lead time.

 

[Anonymous]

This forum is great, the guys in it are great, all opinions I heard are realistic and I 'd gladly take them as advice.
This is the best forum I 've been, I 've been at others where they had outrageously unrealistic opinions and they wanted to impose them on others.

 

[Marv]

I 've been at others where they had outrageously unrealistic opinions and they wanted to impose them on others.

COW

 

[a2jacketpatches]

This forum is great, the guys in it are great, all opinions I heard are realistic and I 'd gladly take them as advice.
This is the best forum I 've been, I 've been at others where they had outrageously unrealistic opinions and they wanted to impose them on others.

Agreed, all opinions in this thread have a lot of good points and most of the guys on the forum ingeneral are great. Any aggressors that I've been so long winded about seem to be at a loss for words. :roll:

 

[ButteMT61]

This forum is great, the guys in it are great, all opinions I heard are realistic and I 'd gladly take them as advice.
This is the best forum I 've been, I 've been at others where they had outrageously unrealistic opinions and they wanted to impose them on others.

Agreed, all opinions in this thread have a lot of good points and most of the guys on the forum ingeneral are great. Any aggressors that I've been so long winded about seem to be at a loss for words. :roll:

Not at all - never been an issue for me. But the thread is dead. I simply chose to let it go. You can do the same or keep it going. I just won't be part of it. Cheers.