ELC IRVINS

[Roughwear]

Don't forget the wartime jackets are 70 years old !!

True, but I own some which are near mint and have had almost no wear. The skin not exposed to the light under the sleeve zips is identical to the rest of outer skin, giving one a very good impression of how the jackets would have looked when first made.

 

[John Lever]

OK, fair point.
Things do change over time though. I once heard that L S Lowry would paint canvasses white then put them in the attic for several years and wait for the white to soften.

 

[m444uk]

[quote="Roughwear said]

Having handled many original Irvins I can say that there were many variations in the fleece and skin sides, largely a reflection of the different varieties of sheep and tanning processes. One thing I have noticed is that the skin itself of most originals tends to be a little thicker than on most repro Irvins. I have yet to see a repro fleece which exactly replicates a wartime one.[/quote]

I agree there is no one definitive jacket but originals seem more solid perhaps due the use of an older animal.
The fleece also don't wear so easily on the cuffs like some batches of Eastmans have done.
I've seen mint jackets at the RAF museum storage and the density was not dissimilar to that of current ELC B3 .50 cal and nothing like the Eastman RAF at the time !
This could be because of drying over time. Perhaps the veg retan Eastman have used leeches out some of the original tanning oils.
(about 7 years ago, I saw some new RAFs at the Imperial war museum shop in London)

Whilst no doubt some Australian skins were used I doubt the Merino or Merino cross with rough skin is the way to make a solid hard wearing jacket.
Any skin imperfections do seem to be prone to tearing.

 

[John Lever]

Remember though the effects of natural selection. The remaining jackets are the strong ones that have survived out of tens of thousands made.
The others have fallen apart decades ago, perhaps even after a few months of wear, due to wear and perhaps even shoddy tanning and manufacture.

 

[m444uk]

Remember though the effects of natural selection. The remaining jackets are the strong ones that have survived out of tens of thousands made.
The others have fallen apart decades ago, perhaps even after a few months of wear, due to wear and perhaps even shoddy tanning and manufacture.

Yes, that's a valid point.

My uncle was in the Fleet Air Arm during the war. He handed his jacket back on demob.
It was in used condition when he first got it.

After the war rough ones were burnt or shredded for mattress stuffing and many good ones probably went to auction the same way as military gear does today. Much of it bought by shops selling working gear. Army leather jerkins, Irvins, white roll neck sweaters etc. All worn to destruction when rationing was still in force.

 

[John Lever]

Regarding the Merino issue, The Few rate them highly enough to make jackets out of them and charge us for the privilege.

 

[deeb7]

Regarding the Merino issue, The Few rate them highly enough to make jackets out of them and charge us for the privilege.

Currently The Few are using South African Merino for some shearlings, others are simply listed as Material:Fenland.

Is the Fenland also merino?

 

[John Lever]

Regarding the Merino issue, The Few rate them highly enough to make jackets out of them and charge us for the privilege.

Currently The Few are using South African Merino for some shearlings, others are simply listed as Material:Fenland.

Is the Fenland also merino?

Fenland is THE tannery where all the best skins come from. It's in Devon. They used to supply Eastman years ago.
It's where I buy materials for custom jackets.

 

[deeb7]

Thanks, John ... yeah, I was just asking if it was also merino?

 

[John Lever]

Thanks, John ... yeah, I was just asking if it was also merino?

I don't think so. I think Merino skins are the only specific breed of sheepskins that are widely available. I thnik many breeds are crosses to give greater size of animal.
If you read the blurb on The Few they say UK domestic Fenland. That's pretty much a Heinz 57 variety type of skin. That's what my RAF is made from, though The Few have their own specifications not available to any one else.

 

[deeb7]

I guess we don't want it to be too cuddly.

 

[m444uk]

Fenland is THE tannery where all the best skins come from. It's in Devon. They used to supply Eastman years ago.
It's where I buy materials for custom jackets.

As the name suggests Fenland tannery is in Bridgewater Somerset.

http://www.fenland-sheepskin.co.uk/

 

[jonnyboy]

Fenland are indeed great. I've been working on my own Irvin jacket project for a nearly a year now, and Fenland have produced fantastic sheepkins for me, matched to an original sample. It's great stuff, and after some testing (soaking/drying/rubbing/etc) it looks and feels very similar to skin on my original wartime jacket.

I'll be starting to put my first jacket together in a week or two (just waiting for a few more materials) so will update you on the progress!

Cheers,

Jon

 

[m444uk]

Fenland are indeed great. I've been working on my own Irvin jacket project for a nearly a year now, and Fenland have produced fantastic sheepkins for me, matched to an original sample. It's great stuff, and after some testing (soaking/drying/rubbing/etc) it looks and feels very similar to skin on my original wartime jacket.

I'll be starting to put my first jacket together in a week or two (just waiting for a few more materials) so will update you on the progress!

Cheers,


Jon

Wow...according to my maths there are now 5 members here involved in making jackets !

 

[jonnyboy]

Wow...according to my maths there are now 5 members here involved in making jackets !

I know - it's like a sewing club!

I think my wife was a little worried initially, when I started buying books on sewing, and popping into haberdashery shops! Now she's quite supportive!

Cheers,

Jon

 

[PADDY_M]

Just your basic Eastman 'Irvin' (PIX)

Knocked off a few shots for you boys. 'Click' on the small images and they will 'magically' GO LARGE.
Just checked the date on this one and it's 1995, (it was written onto the label) so officially 15-years-old now, and looking great for it.

 

[PADDY_M]

Re: ELC IRVINS (Part Deux)

And a FEW more...

 

[John Lever]

Re: ELC IRVINS (Part Deux)

And a FEW more...

Hi Paddy,
Very nice !!
Are any for sale ??

 

[Cliff]

Hi John
Two questions.......have Aero improved on their design of the sleeve (I have an Aero Irvin which I love except that the sleeves are not quite there) and may I be indiscreet and ask what the total cost of your custom Irvin was. Skins, labour , etc ? cheers

Cliff[/quote]

Yes the sleeves are better but the cuffs still too loose, but it's an easy fix. My jacket cost me nothing as it was a test jacket and I spent considerable time organising the skins and the new arm shape template for Aero.

Thanks John, I wil look forward to pics of Aero's new production Irvin then with the a view to me at last buying my Holy Grail of jacket !!

Cheers
Cliff

 

[rikbb]

conservation of the ELC IRVINs!!!!! (sorry)

Moved to other forum chapter