"Belle of the Brawl"

[YoungMedic]

Patch dimensions are 5 inches "around" and 5.5 inches from bomb nose to tail

 

[CBI]

where/who is making these - they look nice!

 

[YoungMedic]

phase III : patches sewn on, waiting for rank rockers and name tag. Then off to paint.

 

[YoungMedic]

I think I have figured out why the patch looks so big. It would appear that some contract jackets have bigger and higher placed pockets than others. Of course the pockets on this cooper are all wrong, but it would appear the Acme Jackets had the largest pockets on them.

Can anyone confirm or deny this?

ACME

Dubow

RW

 

[unclegrumpy]

A lot of chenille patches were slightly oversized...especially for example the 535th BS. I think the jacket contract is part of what you are seeing, but the size of the jacket makes a bigger difference. A regulation 5" patch looks bigger on the chest of a size 38 jacket than a size 44.

 

[TankBuster]

A lot of chenille patches were slightly oversized...especially for example the 535th BS. I think the jacket contract is part of what you are seeing, but the size of the jacket makes a bigger difference. A regulation 5" patch looks bigger on the chest of a size 38 jacket than a size 44.

Exactly. I think that is what throws alot of guys off. Most original jackets were size 38's and 40's. Most guys today wear size 42's and 44's. That will definitely make that patch look smaller!

 

[a2jacketpatches]

A lot of chenille patches were slightly oversized...especially for example the 535th BS. I think the jacket contract is part of what you are seeing, but the size of the jacket makes a bigger difference. A regulation 5" patch looks bigger on the chest of a size 38 jacket than a size 44.

Agreed, the patch looks bigger than 5" because it is.

When doing repros for modern larger size jackets, I do what would be a 5" patch a little bigger. It only makes sense. How many size 46 were there during the war? Not many, once you go bigger than that they start to look small if 5'' The chest size is the chest size regardless of pocket placement. And my guess is that certain contracts are done proportionately as opposed to a standard size considering size 46 plus. There's no way you could take the measurements of a size 42 or 44 jacket components and simply stitch to a larger size body without everything looking a little odd.

So if doing this patch to fit on a much larger jacket and have the same look it has to be enlarged a bit. If the original patch is 5.5 on the original jacket say 42, the repro patch might be 6" on a size 46 -48 jacket to look the same size proportionately.

Personally I like the look of larger patches on the chest, and that's why I pay special attention to this point. Of course, all can be ordered whatever size is preferred. The only way to really get it right, is to have circles in increments one 1/2 inch, place them where they should be roughly an eyeball it til it looks right.

I will take some photos a little later using my parsons jacket to show what I mean and start a new post called patch placement, size, etc. It'll illustrate my method and rules of thumb I've used for many years.

 

[YoungMedic]

well we had the dimensions of the original patch, just trying to figure out why: A it looks way bigger than the 5.25 inches that the repro was made, and B why it fits on the jacket where it does, approx 1-2 in above the pocket flap and the top falls into the mid chest shoulder area

And the jacket its going on is a 40 or 42. Its currently a 40, and yes one of the appealing things about this jacket has been the larger patch. It looks great, which is why Im trying to get it right

 

[shedonwanna]

If the nametag on the vintage jacket is 4 inches then 18th BS patch looks to be at least 6 inches diameter. That's just my guess...

 

[a2jacketpatches]

If the nametag on the vintage jacket is 4 inches then 18th BS patch looks to be at least 6 inches diameter. That's just my guess...

You're spot on, my guess on page 1 of this thread was 5.5 - 6 inches based on it being about twice the size of the SSI. I won't be able to post the pics I wanted to tonight, but will some time tomorrow.

 

[a2jacketpatches]

Here's another variant of you patch

 

[YoungMedic]

Check that out. Very cool.

Any idea of its origin or manufacturer?

 

[a2jacketpatches]

Found on Ebay but lost it. Looks to be a good cut edge patch, as for mfg. I have no idea.

 

[YoungMedic]

I began the painting portion of this project. I have no artistic ability whatsoever, so I either had to find an artist or sign painter to do the jacket for me, or find a way to do it myself. After investigating several options, I decided to give it a go. I originally bought this Cooper thinking it would be "good enough' for my tastes, but after spending alot of time on this forum, I realized that good enough is not going to work. Ive got a bigger SSI, and an ELC RW 27752 to eventually use, but Im going to use this Cooper as a trial run, and do it again on a proper jacket. After all, I always do things better the second time, but I'm pretty happy with the way it came out.

So what I wound up doing is cropping out portions of the jacket, rendering them black and white on my computer, and printing them out to the correct size to use as a tracing template.

Then I placed fabric transfer paper behind the templates and traced the designs onto the jacket

Then I used paint markers to fill in the outlines. I debated on using acrylic or oil based paints, and from what I have read, the oils will soak into the leather and wear better over time, giving a more genuine look.

So I'm pretty happy with the way it turned out, like I said I'm no artist.

 

[a2jacketpatches]

The first items I recommend to guys with limited artistic ability, transfer paper and paint markers, and you figured it out on your own. The paints are of good quality and pens are easy to use. Came out great for your first shot so give yourself some credit and keep on going.

 

[YoungMedic]

Thanks

 

[YoungMedic]

So I finally returned to the Belle of the Brawl. I have been to DC several times since my last trip to the museum but I was never able to squeeze it in, as the museum is about 30-40 minutes outside the DC area, by Dulles Airport. I was able to answer alot of questions that have been posed in this thread. It was pretty difficult to get quality pictures because the lighting and reflections off the glass case, but I took some more detail shots that may help ID the jacket better.



This jacket appears small, I would even venture to say a 36, which would answer why the patch looks so big. Also, comparing the nametag to the one on the jacket I was wearing, this strip appears to only be 2.5-3 inches long at the most, making the patch look bigger as well.



I took some detail of the shoulder patch and epaulets



and the slider as best I could



It was great to go back and see all the jackets, particularly since the last time I went, I had literally no knowledge of vintage leather jackets. This forum is truly a joy to be a part of. I think I learn something every time I log in, and gives me a greater appreciation for the history behind these jackets and the heroes that wore them. Here's the future of jacket collecting

 

[Anonymous]

nice thread

 

[YoungMedic]

I stumbled across a new (to me) picture of the Belle jacket, I've never seen it out of the case. It appears to indeed be a size 36 jacket, the pockets look HUGE now.

Cool to see a better color / grain on the jacket as well. From John Slemp's website :

Aerographs - Aviation Photography - Atlanta

www.aerographs.com

 

[ausreenactor]

Hell of a patch!