Army Aviation Jacket And Patch Question

[Atticus]

I just bought a 1985 light-weight flight jacket. Its not a CWU-36/P. Its the olive green, "poplin" nomex jacket that is issued to Army helicopter crew...or at least it was issued to them in the seventies and eighties.

Anyhow, it came with much of its original stuff. For example, it came with a tea cup of sand in its crevasses and a half dozen soiled earplugs in its cigarette pocket. But there are also warrant officer bars on the shoulders, a 42nd Infantry Division patch on one sleeve and a 2nd Support Brigade patch on the other. Frankly, I had no idea that the 2nd Support Brigade was a unit of the Rainbow Division. Oh, and it has two empty Velcro receivers on the chest...one round and one for the name tag.

Again, the jacket was made in 1985...I have no clue as to when it was issued. Do any of you Army guys who served in the desert care to speculate as to my jacket’s history? Any info would be appreciated.

AF

 

[watchmanjimg]

I just bought a 1985 light-weight flight jacket. Its not a CWU-36/P. Its the olive green, "poplin" nomex jacket that is issued to Army helicopter crew...or at least it was issued to them in the seventies and eighties.

Anyhow, it came with much of its original stuff. For example, it came with a tea cup of sand in its crevasses and a half dozen soiled earplugs in its cigarette pocket. But there are also warrant officer bars on the shoulders, a 42nd Infantry Division patch on one sleeve and a 2nd Support Brigade patch on the other. Frankly, I had no idea that the 2nd Support Brigade was a unit of the Rainbow Division. Oh, and it has two empty Velcro receivers on the chest...one round and one for the name tag.

Again, the jacket was made in 1985...I have no clue as to when it was issued. Do any of you Army guys who served in the desert care to speculate as to my jacket’s history? Any info would be appreciated.

AF

Geoff:

The presence of shoulder patches on both sleeves of an Army jacket does not suggest that the respective units are affiliated. The patch on the left sleeve denotes the wearer's current unit (or at least the one in which the wearer was serving as of the last time the garment was worn), while the patch on the right sleeve reflects combat service with a particular unit. I know that the 42nd has been deployed to Iraq in support of the Global War on Terrorism, but perhaps the mystery will unravel further if you'd tell us which sleeve the patch is on.

Jim

 

[Atticus]

Thanks, Jim. The 42 Infantry Division patch is on the left sleeve, the 2nd Support Brigade patch is on the right. Here's a photo of the jacket from the auction.

I have never understood the lack of interest in these jackets. Seems to me that they deserve a place in anyone's nylon collection the same as any other nomex jacket. This is actually my second one. My other is an unpatched jacket that I bought from Brooks, years ago.

AF

 

[watchmanjimg]

Thanks, Jim. The 42 Infantry Division patch is on the left sleeve, the 2nd Support Brigade patch is on the right. Here's a photo of the jacket from the auction.

I have never understood the lack of interest in these jackets. Seems to me that they deserve a place in anyone's nylon collection the same as any other nomex jacket. This is actually my second one. My other is an unpatched jacket that I bought from Brooks, years ago.

AF

Geoff:

As always, it's my pleasure to help. I'm right there with you regarding the unfortunate lack of interest in these jackets, but then again that only leaves more for those of us who do appreciate them.

 

[helodrvr]

Atticus,

The Army issued nomex jackets starting somewhere in the early 1970's. When I went through Army flight school starting in June of 1970 and graduating in April of 1971, I was issued a sage-green, Air Force type flight jacket. I was issued my first Nomex jacket upon returning from Viet Nam when assigned to the 101st Airborne Division in July of 1972. I was issued these jackets until the mid 1980's when the CWU's started to be issued to the Army. Shortly after that, the Air Force started re-issuing the A-2.

If the Army jackets seem to have less general appeal, it may well reflect upon the feelings most Army aviator's had for them. The two piece Nomex Army uniforms of the same era were very practical in hot climates. But that didn't necessary endear them to those of us who wore them. We wanted one-piece, sage-green Air Force flight suits. That is, flight suits that looked like flight suits instead of mis-directed tanker uniforms. We would trade weapons and things the Air Force flyers did not have easy access to for flight suits, and later for flight jackets (CWU's.) When the Air Force started re-issuing the A-2, the level of envy increased in geometric progressions. And that is to say nothing of the desire to own a G-1, any G-1.

To state things a little differently, the aviation portions of the Army are generally regarded as being the red-headed step child of the Infantry and Armor. When they needed us, they loved us. But generally we were considered to be prima-donna pains in the ass. So the Army's greater plan to better integrate aviation into its fold was to try and make us be more like the rest of the Army. Utility helicopter pilots and crews were little better than airborne truck drivers in their eyes. So the resentment the aviation section crews felt tended to color our preceptions of the equipment we were issued.

In truth, the Army issued, green Nomex jackets I was issued were not nearly as durable as the later CWU designs. Though flame resistant, they really weren't as durable and comfortable as the earlier nylon flight jackets either. I am glad you see value in them. But for me, I have worn them more than enough...

 

[watchmanjimg]

Mel:

These are fascinating comments. Interestingly, as an M60A3 tank crewman in the late '80s I was anxious to transition into the Nomex CVC coverall and corresponding jacket (albeit the cold-weather version of the type Geoff posted) because these garments set their wearer apart from the BDU-clad rank and file. By then the sage green Nomex CWU-27/P flightsuit was standard wear for Army aviators in my division, along with the Army Nomex jacket. I wound up getting out before my unit transitioned into the M1 Abrams and its Nomex ensemble, but I had this jacket patched up for casual wear and still enjoy it over 20 years later:

 

[helodrvr]

The older I get, the more I appreciate getting a chance to see the same thing from different vantage points. As a young warrant officer, new in-country in Viet Nam, I couldn't wait for my flight suits and tropical fatigues to get at least a little bleached out, so I wouldn't look like such a newbie. I liken it to the patina folks like to conjure up with hot water treatment on horsehide. Fortunately, I didn't have to wait too long as the two piece Nomex seemed to lighten and go a little bit brown pretty quickly in the tropical sun. The fact that most of the laundry was done by hand and dried in the sun surely sped up the process.

When I was in the 101st, later, I can remember being required to "blouse" our flight suit pants above our boots. Being part of the new "airmobile" 101st, they still had difficulty letting go of the paratrooper heritage. We were required to either tuck our pants legs into the tops of the boots (always a bit uncomfortable with the large velcro tabs on the bottom of each leg,) or to use "blousing garters" to achieve the look they desired rather than to enjoy the full protection the pants offered by pulling the pants legs down, over the boots and then snugging them with the velcro tabs. Ah, such fond memories... Then there was the change over to berets. Now that was a sight to see, a division of soldiers who had only seen photos of berets on the Green Berets and eccentric Frenchmen suddenly directed to wear them. The question comes to mind, "how many ways can you wear a beret?" And the answer would be that in a division like the 101st, there was at least one variation per soldier. But I digress.

The Army Nomex was functional. It tended to have pretty big color shifts with wear and exposure to sunlight. They used some very unusual velcro type material for the sleeves and legs of the two piece flight suits. I guess to a 20 year old, and even later, the cut of an A-2 with epaulets or a G-1 with those great collars, bi-swing arms, and belts were much more attractive. It was probably more a case of the grass being greener... like my flight suits. It has been much the same for many years. The early A-2's were admired by the Navy fliers as the M-422s were coveted by the AAF fliers. The first guys who got B-10's and B-15's were eyed closely by those who had the old, stiff leather jackets. And so on...brown boots, black boots. I flew Cobras but wished I could get a seat in an A-10, or an Abrams!

 

[Marv]

Hey Mel,

A wonderful insight into the loves and loathes of your Army issued flight clothing, would be very interested to hear more about your exploits as a helo pilot in Vietnam (if you have the time of course) as I am quite interested in that period etc.

 

[Atticus]

Thanks for the replies, all.

So I am thinking that my jacket was worn by a warrant officer who once served in combat with the 2nd Support Brigade but then, later, served with the 42nd Infantry Division. And while he was with the 42nd, his specific squadron, or whatever is the Army equivalent, would have been indicated by the missing patch worn on the right chest.

I don’t think that I’ll sell all my G-1s in favor of wearing this little Army jacket…but it has turned out to be a great Spring-morning-drive-to-work-with-the-Jeep-doors-out jacket. As I said in my earlier post, I've had one of these things in my collection for years. I never wore it much because it wasn't patched and it just looked like a green golf (I hate golf) jacket you'd buy at Belk's. But, of course, this newer one is patched and it looks more like a military flight jacket.

AF