Modern USAF Branded Garments A-2

[FtrPlt]

All,
I'm looking to add a Branded Garments jacket to my collection. From previous posts, this company appears to have continued putting the 1992 contract label on their jackets.

Any guidance on telling the issue jackets from the post-contract production jacket? An earlier post references post-contract jackets being a different color. Also lining material being a different composition.

Thanks

 

[Phantomfixer]

If post contract = not usgi issue, then the NSN will not be on the label. The NSN will be with 8415-00-xxx-xxxx. The last four indicate size of the A-2, I believe the 3 digit code identifies the garment as an A-2. Either way the tag will say NSN 8415..If not, it is a civilian jacket.
it can say NSN 8145 or any other series of combinations, but this is to throw off the buyer into thinking it is USGI..a marketing ploy....Cooper did the same thing with their orange label tags..
Bummer I just got rid of a Branded A-2....they are on the bay cheap enough though....

Good luck
JZ

 

[FtrPlt]

The problem is that Branded Garments apparently continues to use the mil-spec label on their post-government contract jackets -- i.e. the full USAF label is still in them, complete with NSN, DLA number, etc.

Per a post by Atticus a while back, the 92 contract jackets are a dark seal color -- noticably different from the Saddlery jackets which preceded it. Also per a PM from earlier, the lining is a different material. The post-contract production apparently has velcro for both nametag and major command patch -- i.e they have mil tags, proper velcro, but are not contract/issue jackets.

Several on eBay at the moment and they make an interesting study. The first jacket is the same color as on the early Saddlery jackets rather than seal. Note the velcro is present. Also note the pocket flaps -- one nicely scalloped; the other not so much. Could just be camera angle? Correct mil-spec tag.

Second jacket looks the right color and has nicely shaped pocket flaps. The lining is very dark and probably not the correct material. Finally, no indication of a command patch but evidence of the nametag velcro is visible. Note again the proper mil-spec tag.

Are these issue jackets? Per the above, they seem to fit the category of post-contract production.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/321591618282
http://www.ebay.com/itm/141477096272

 

[FtrPlt]

Adding to the confusion, here's one that looks pretty good -- proper color, proper label, proper-appearing lining. However, the nametag velcro is sewn through the lining -- although there appears to be stitching from a prior velcro. No sign of a command patch.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321591618282

And, finally, this one. Again, it appears the proper color; has the velcro for nametag and command patch. Totally bogus spec tag.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/221593657158

 

[Phantomfixer]

It is my understanding from talking with supply troops, and contracting guys at Dover AFB, it is against the law, or against regulations, for a manufacturer to sell items with a National Stock Number NSN and Defense Logistic Agency contract number label to the public, I think this is why Cooper had the Saddlery label.

The problem with modern A-2's, and aircrew, is that any A-2 that is close to mil spec (as I understand it, there is no mil-spec for modern A-2's, there is a general description) is acceptable for wear in uniform. Pop's in Turkey routinely takes issue A-2's and swaps them to aircrews for his version, which has underarm gussets, pockets in the liner etc...and no NSN tag

the auctions posted look to be USGI with exception of course to the last...note that the 42 size the last four of the NSN is 6403 and the 44 is 6405....

When stationed at Dover AFB, I would go to the equipment issue store and check out the new A-2s on the rack....there were many different shades of seal and russet on the rack,, from the early russet Saddlery to the dark Avirex and Branded. The point is, when it comes to shades, they vary greatly even in the same production run...even sizes were different fitting..

good luck hope that helps clear things up...like coffee...but if it has the NSN and DLA number it should be USGI.. Branded should not be selling jackets, to the public, with NSN numbers and DLA contract numbers, these number are what identifies the item as being US property, NOT for resale (unless declared surplus by the US government, a whole new can of worms), vs a commercial item available for sale

 

[FtrPlt]

Thanks for your reply. I agree with you that non-military issue items shouldn't have NSN's, DLA numbers, etc. On the legal side, I have no idea of what the law says with regards to putting mil-spec labels onto items being sold into the commercial market? Against the law and against regulations are two vastly different things. In the case of Branded Garments, they appear to have included them on their post-contract jackets.

Your comments about modified jackets are spot-on. The major difference is that we're talking about as-issued, unmodified, how-you-got-it-from-the-government jackets. While the pattern, color, and materials have changed since 1988, they remain very consistent within each contract -- eg 88/92 Saddlery jackets are russet/brown and much lighter than the color specifed for the Branded/Cockpit/Avirex contracts.

One feature common to all the modern jackets is the velcro. I've yet to see a USAF-issued jacket without the velcro for nametag and command patch factory applied. Even if the velcro is removed, the outlines/stitch holes will remain (I have an orange-tag Cooper that I removed the nametag velcro from -- the outline is still clearly visible 25 years later). I'd be very comfortable with premise that no command patch velcro (or traces thereof) = non-issue jacket

From experience in other collecting fields, I long ago adopted the methodology of presuming everything is a fake/repro until it proves itself otherwise. While fakes aren't generally a problem with modern USAF-issue A-2s, in the case of Branded jackets, there appears to be reason for caution.

This is a photo posted by Atticus back in April 2013. The jacket is a known, USAF-issue Branded Garments 1992 contract jacket. The issue of Branded possibly using mil labels on their post-contract jackets was being discussed back in 2008 -- http://www.vintageleatherjackets.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14986

 

[Phantomfixer]

"I'd be very comfortable with premise that no command patch velcro (or traces thereof) = non-issue jacket"

You are right... I have not handled any US issue jackets that did not have the velcro sewn on at the factory, never through the liner..

good luck with the hunt AF actually turned me on to the Branded jacket...well made and comfortable...