V505 Australian-made A2

[Roughwear]

You rarely see these Australian made A2s come up for sale. So is it really made from Kangaroo hide? It looks like goatskin, but as I have never owned a jacket made from Kangaroo hide I really don't know.

http://cgi.ebay.com/RARE-WWII-THEATER-M ... 255fd31265

 

[Tim P]

No reason why it shouldnt be kangaroo hide. Aussies eat and use Kangaroo. What Ido like is the roomy sleeves and body of the 505's. I can imagine these being comfortable. Would love to see a repop.
The size is nearer a 38 at best..

 

[MikeyB-17]

Who's upset him then? Nobody from here I hope. My motorbike gloves are roo hide, and look quite similar to that stuff-I don't imagine it was a scarce commodity in Australia. Very tough stuff it is.

 

[deeb7]

Who's upset him then? Nobody from here I hope.

Oh I see, I missed the giant font rant ...

• *** I have received a few nasty emails regarding this jacket. This jacket is real and not some humped up item. It was very common for patches to be removed and different patches added during the war/period of use. Probably 40% of the flight jackets I have ever owned that were actually used have some sort of patch removal or alteration of some kind. People changed units, changed squadrons, got shot down, traded jackets, lost them in card games, etc, etc.. When I listed the jacket I didn't even notice the extra stitching holes around the name strip and 5th Air Force patch. If someone did this after the war to deceive someone, I would assume that they would line up the stitching holes. The soldier did this when there was a war going on, and I'm sure didn't consider what some 15 year old flight jacket "expert" was going to think 65+ years later on an online forum. The flash from my digital camera really makes the extra stitch holes stand out in the photos. I have been proud to have this jacket in my collection and I really feel that it is a great jacket. All of you eBay "experts" are so negative and rude it is unbelievable. I posted 30 photos of the jacket with the listing. If you like the jacket great, if not simply don't bid on it. I think I may just end the listing in the next few days and keep this scarce jacket in my collection. Sorry about the rant, but I get tired of defending real items on here and watching some of these obvious fakes sell for huge money. Thanks

 

[Andrew]

Oh i'd love to get that- but I have a feeling it'll go big $. Theatre made stuff always seems to get good prices.

I don't know what it's made from but I would say it's Cow (Calf maybe?) or Goat as the normal domesticated types would probably have been the things used. I also suspect the only people eating Kangaroos back then were the First Australians.

Still it does look a bit like these samples of Kangaroo that I sourced a few years ago.

Here's my flying gloves with the same label- I suspect V505 was either Stagg Leathergoods or Lasicas.

 

[Andrew]

Just read some of the subsequent comments and the faded patch is identified as 22nd BG. If it is the CBI patch is a mystery as the chronology for the 22nd doesn't locate them anywhere near the CBI region. Straight from Australia to New Guinea, and on up to the Philippines and Okinawa.

Activities

In support of the Allied offensive in South West Pacific, attacked enemy shipping, installations, troop concentrations, and airfields in New Guinea and New Britain. Earned a Distinguished Unit Citation for air raids over enemy forces in Papua (Jul 1942-Jan 1943).

Locations

1 March 1942: Amberley Field, Queensland, Australia
5 April 1942: Garbutt Field, Reid River and Antill Plains, Queensland, Australia
5 July 1942: Woodstock, Queensland, Australia
2 October 1942: Iron Range, Queensland, Australia

1943: Moving forward
Activities

Earned a Distinguished Unit Citation for destroying enemy entrenchments that were preventing the advance of Australian ground forces in New Guinea (5 Nov 1943).

Locations

4 February 1943: Woodstock, Queensland, Australia
9 October 1943: Dobodura, New Guinea

1944: Re-equipping and working from front line island bases
Activities

Converted from medium, twin engined B-25 Mitchell and B-26 marauder bombers to heavy four engined B-24 Liberator bombers. Following its conversion to B-24 Liberators, on 11 Feb 1944 the 22nd Bomb Group was redesignated 22 Bomb Group, Heavy. Bombed Japanese airfields, shipping, and oil installations in Borneo, Ceram, and Halmahera. Began raiding the southern Philippines in Sep 1944 to neutralize Japanese bases in preparation for the invasion of Leyte.

Locations

13 January 1944: Nadzab, New Guinea

11 August 1944: Owi Island, New Guinea

15 November 1944: Leyte, Philippine Islands

26 November 1944: Angaur, Palau Islands


1945: A hard-won victory
Activities

From December 1944 to August 1945, struck airfields and installations on Luzon, supported Australian ground forces on Borneo, and bombed railways and industries in Formosa and China. Moved to Okinawa in Aug 1945 and flew some armed reconnaissance missions over southern Japan.

Locations

20 January 1945: Samar, Philippine Islands

12 March 1945: Clark Field, Luzon, Philippine Islands

15 August 1945: Motobu, Okinawa (Japanese surrender)

 

[Roughwear]

Fascinating research with an excellent chronology, Andrew. Thanks for posting it.

 

[TankBuster]

Interesting. It sure does look like the Red Raider painted on there. The CBI may be a later add on, but the rest sure adds up. I think it will do well. Especially with Mr. Chapmans extra info.

 

[philip.ed]

Nice gauntlets, Andrew. If you have an AM pair, how does the leather differ? Would you say any version is better made?

 

[tater]

I know USN airmen used a CBI patch later in the war when they operated closer to the China coast. There is every possibility they did as well since once they got to the Philipines, USAAF bomb groups attacked coastal targets technically in the CBI (China and Indochina).

Just checked Revenge of the Red Raiders (a 602 page unit history of the 22d BG and excellent book, BTW)), and they bombed China many times in 1945.''anyway, a CBI patch seems reasonable for Spring of '45 to me.

 

[tater]

I skimmed some of the several hundred pictures in the book I mentioned above and could not make out any of the patches—though there were patches, and all kinds of uniforms (from shorts to fleece jackets (they operated B-26s and B-24s—the latter at high altitude, the former typically medium alt.

Given numerous raids on Hong Kong and Canton, I think a CBI patch is reasonable.

BTW, all the books by this group are must have books for anyone interested in air operations in the SWPA. They are literally day by day unit histories of specific groups, with hundreds of pictures and notes on virtually every mission flown.

Their site:
http://airwar-worldwar2.com/

I've ordered from them (own all their books) they are fine to buy from.

 

[LtGustl]

Servus from Vienna,

if somebody would like to see some pics for comparison, please look at this post at FL

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/show...05-Size-40&s=e5632b1effe646ea9390793843777182

on my jacket were two patches sewed on (a big one & a smaller one - could be 5th?)
- now only the stich holes are visible, sorry

kindest regards & merry christmas

 

[Jason]

Has anyone tried contacting Stagg Leather to see if anyone there knows if the V505 designator belonged to them?
It appears as if they've moved to a small country town called Foster (outside Melbourne) and only import now, rather than doing their own manufacturing inhouse?
If work doesn't hammer me too hard tomorrow, I might give them a call and see.

 

[deeb7]

Has anyone tried contacting Stagg Leather to see if anyone there knows if the V505 designator belonged to them?

They knew nothing when Bob Capa tried ...

viewtopic.php?p=53006#p53006

 

[Jason]

That's interesting, maybe they've done some digging since then, as their website proudly announces "Most of the early manufacturing contracted work was for military gloves and other contract work." Its interesting to note that Mars & Stagg still have, apparently, seperate businesses. Mars is in the heart of Melbourne, and Stagg is in Foster down the Gippsland (home of the best tasting yoghurt in the world BTW)

Might give them a call this morning, and see if they know more.

 

[deeb7]

Might give them a call this morning, and see if they know more.

Good plan ... we tried sending Andrew off to Melbourne to do some research, but he was dazzled by the bright lights.

 

[Andrew]

Actually it was the Squires...

That other thread has reminded me of the discussion and now I recall I have also seen Ikes and tunics with the same label so that suggests that it's not Stagg. That idea was based on reviewing different Australian Type B flying helmets which were as far as I could see only made by Stagg and Lasicas and labelled such early on then later labelled with the two different codes and comparing these to the leather used in the gloves. Not terribly scientific though.

 

[Stony]

Look on page 117 of "Art of the Flight Jacket" for a 22nd BG painting on a B-10 I used to own. I've tried a couple of times to buy it back from the guy that bought it from me, but he won't budge. The jacket also had all of the guys medals and some other stuff. One I should have never let go of.

 

[asiamiles]

Good plan ... we tried sending Andrew off to Melbourne to do some research, but he was dazzled by the bright lights.

Howzat?! Few bright lights for the Aussies in Melbourne on this Boxing Day morning!

 

[Andrew]

Good plan ... we tried sending Andrew off to Melbourne to do some research, but he was dazzled by the bright lights.

Howzat?! Few bright lights for the Aussies in Melbourne on this Boxing Day morning!

Where were you last week?

Actually I wouldn't normally give a toss about Cricket but even for me it's been a quite an entertaining Ashes so far.