TYPE A-1 Dateline

[Ken at Aero Leather]

Following on the interest in The Goldsmith A-2 thread has the dateline of The A-1 ever been discussed on VLJ

I have always had a theory that there must have been three design version, I’ve handled plenty of what I believe to be the second and third version but I’ve never seen even in a photo of what is logically the first and original version.

Has anyone ever come across one with no pockets?

Most original A-1s we see, and all the repro makers versions except Aero’s, make what (for arguments sake) can we call the 2nd version.

I’ve always assumed that a sample, or a number of the 1st issue were made without any pockets, some may or may not have made it into service. but delivery of most or all of these of A-1s i suggest was made before the AC freaked, realising an error had been made, and they were sent back to the maker have pockets fitted “aftermarket" as the design is so obviously a correction or alteration.

The fact that the pockets are sewn on the outside of the jacket, after it’s finished, and straight through the lining is madness. It’s harder to fit pockets to finished jacket, it looks worse, and it’s harder to repair the jacket should it be needed and even worse where repairs are concerned, positioning them on top of the knit is crazy

Late versions or 3rd issue, will be those fitted with pockets in the traditional manner during rather than after production, the logical method always in use before and after the mid 1920s, and ever since

This appears to be one of those 3rd issue, that's the model Aero choose to replicate

 

[zoomer]

That "late" version has a button waist!

 

[Grant]

Hey Ken,
It's funny how people today call all capeskin button up jackets with two button pockets from the 20's and 30's an A-1. It was a common work jacket design as well. Unless the spec label denotes it as an A-1, what you're calling a "3rd issue" looks like one of those.

 

[johnwayne]

Is the jacket shown part of Aero's archive Ken? Hard to see from the pic but is the label military spec?
Interesting topic, I've always thought the A1 a great looking jacket just with ridiculously small and impractical pockets albeit A2 pockets aren't much better!
Out of curiosity Ken how many jackets in the archive and can visitors to see it?

 

[Dr H]

No, that one has been posted here and on FL (it/was for sale in the Far East for £8k or similar). It’s an Air Associates jacket if I recall correctly.

 

[Skyhawk]

That jacket is an Air Associates civilian model. I researched that one for a project. It is talked about in detail here:
http://vintageleatherjackets.org/th...ir-associates-reproduction.20620/#post-193650

The jacket pictures were taken in a Japanese vintage store and it was selling for over 100,000 yen from what I remember. I believe the photos were posted by a member over at the FL. He was either there or a friend was.

Recently I have discovered that they got the knits wrong when they were replaced. The collar was actually a 37J1 style collar with no snap on the original jacket. You can tell by screenshots from the movie "Torpedo Run" that the jacket was used in.

The jacket can be dated to 1935 at the earliest by the original unique swirl style casein buttons on it. George Morrell has the patent for those buttons registered in 1935.

Regards,
Jay

 

[Dr H]

Has anyone ever come across one with no pockets?

I have seen modern (internet) photos of an early 20th century, buttoned, knit collar jacket in capeskin without pockets. John Lever may recall as we did discuss it several years ago, but it looked like a civilian cycling/golfing windcheater rather than a mil spec A-1.

 

[Ken at Aero Leather]

Hey Ken,
It's funny how people today call all capeskin button up jackets with two button pockets from the 20's and 30's an A-1. It was a common work jacket design as well. Unless the spec label denotes it as an A-1, what you're calling a "3rd issue" looks like one of those.

The pic was merely to illustrate the pocket set up rather than defining that particular jacket as an AC Issue

 

[Ken at Aero Leather]

Is the jacket shown part of Aero's archive Ken? Hard to see from the pic but is the label military spec?
Interesting topic, I've always thought the A1 a great looking jacket just with ridiculously small and impractical pockets albeit A2 pockets aren't much better!
Out of curiosity Ken how many jackets in the archive and can visitors to see it?

The jacket isn't ours, I don't think we have an A-1 right now but last time I was down there were 3 or 4 AN-J-3s
Anyone who makes the trip to Gala is welcome to see whatever they want, whether that's going through archives, meeting the folk who will be making their jacket, choosing the leather for an order straight off the racks, sitting down and have a coffee and a sandwich from M&S, dogs are kids are made very welcome
As to how many jackets we've got that are in the archives? I've no idea but there are plenty to see, there are some rarities there, some for sale, some not, mostly rare civvy jackets which has always been my first love and Aero's stock-in-trade plus a fairly decent range of very early Aero.

 

[Ken at Aero Leather]

I have seen modern (internet) photos of an early 20th century, buttoned, knit collar jacket in capeskin without pockets. John Lever may recall as we did discuss it several years ago, but it looked like a civilian cycling/golfing windcheater rather than a mil spec A-1.

This is what I'm hopeful of un-earthing, not to replicate, we have a big enought problem talking folk out of having inside pockets fitted in our jackets.
I can't see a pocket free jacket catching on, although I must have sold 20000+ pairs of velvet trousers without pockets in the late 60s :>)
Most of my customers kept their belongings down the leg of their knee high Patchwork boots

 

[Persimmon]

This is what I'm hopeful of un-earthing, not to replicate, we have a big enought problem talking folk out of having inside pockets fitted in our jackets.
I can't see a pocket free jacket catching on, although I must have sold 20000+ pairs of velvet trousers without pockets in the late 60s :>)
Most of my customers kept their belongings down the leg of their knee high Patchwork boots

Ah .. the good old days ...

 

[Skyhawk]

Groovy man!

 

[Ken at Aero Leather]

Here's one for a quiz

A Suit and boots I made in 1969

Can anyone name the girl? or the photographer (harder, obviously)

 

[Dr H]

Penelope Tree? David Bailey?

 

[Ken at Aero Leather]

Penelope Tree? David Bailey?

Very quick and spot on, I suppose once you got her, his name fell into place

 

[Dr H]

Yes Ken, she has a very distinctive face; he was the most logical photographer of the time/stature (Bailey was an educated guess).

 

[Dr H]

The jacket pictures were taken in a Japanese vintage store and it was selling for over 100,000 yen from what I remember.

Must have been more than that Jay? ¥100,000 is under £700 ($900). Perhaps a zero missing?

 

[Skyhawk]

Ooops yes. It was 1,500,000 Yen and miss identified on the tag.

 

[Ken at Aero Leather]

Wow, and look at all the missed stitch holes on the new knit.
I'd have gone mental if one of our repair girls had left that sort of footprint

 

[zoomer]

The fact that the pockets are sewn on the outside of the jacket, after it’s finished, and straight through the lining is madness. It’s harder to fit pockets to finished jacket, it looks worse, and it’s harder to repair the jacket should it be needed and even worse where repairs are concerned, positioning them on top of the knit is crazy

Just as a crazy guess: maybe the AAC figured the'y be less likely to rip off with use if they were stitched all the way thru?