A-2 with B-3 collar !

[bombs away]

Hello,

Just found these pics of 2 A-2s modified with B-3 collars.
The result is quite... weird.
Would you buy one like these today ?

Tim.

 

[Andrew]

Wierd indeed, with the minimal benefit that an A-2 provides for basic warmth it seems strange that they'd even bother with going that far to keep the neck warm. I wonder how it was supposed to work- flipped up?

 

[Roughwear]

Thanks for posting these very unusual pics. The shearling collars make the A2s look top heavy. Now I wonder whether the collars came off damaged B-3s.

 

[MikeyB-17]

Looks plain daft-can't really see the point, although I'm sure there must have been one. The one in the second pic looks to still have the A-2 collar underneath.

 

[watchmanjimg]

Is it possible they fitted the fur collars with snaps underneath as seen on early moto jackets? This way they could be removed as dictated by climate conditions (or good taste). :lol: It would also explain the obvious gap seen in the pictures.

 

[asiamiles]

Looks plain daft-can't really see the point, although I'm sure there must have been one.

To keep the back of the neck warm in the air...same reason G-1's have a fur collar. I guess an alternative to a scarf.

 

[jacketimp]

Thanks for posting these very unusual pics. The shearling collars make the A2s look top heavy. Now I wonder whether the collars came off damaged B-3s.

i luv top heavy luvvies..........

 

[jacketimp]

Hello,

Just found these pics of 2 A-2s modified with B-3 collars.
The result is quite... weird.
Would you buy one like these today ?
Tim.

with provenance......why not........coming from an ace fighter pilot.......defo......$3500dollah

 

[Dr H]

Not sure that I'd want to change my nickname to 'Joey' to wear it though...'Kanga' certainly, 'Roo' without a doubt, but 'Joey'?

 

[zoomer]

bombs: Are you at liberty to say where the pix came from?

I ask because they look Early War (up to mid 1942 that is). Note the officers' black ties and even a stiff dress cap with a rain cover! That guy didn't know there was a war on.

An AAC unit with ANY modified gear that early in WW2 is highly unusual. Especially winter gear, because the US was not yet fighting in the cold regions. We had B-17s (the a/c painted on one man's jacket) and P-38s in Greenland and Iceland - on ASW patrol and/or making ready for the Ferry Command to Britain - plus a few hundred marines and soldiers up there. And that was about it for the whole ETO!

Operation Bolero and the North Atlantic Route
Greenland, Arctic Outpost

 

[bombs away]

Hi Zoomer,

Here are the original pics, they come from Footnote but unfortunately no dates.

The only thing I can notice to help is that the bombers are B-17G, the last version (march 1944 if I remember well).

I hope it helps,

Tim.

 

[zoomer]

Well! Bye bye Greenland, then! Just shows to go ya...details can be deceiving.

Dame Satan II was indeed a B-17G, with the 322nd BS, 91st BG, based out of Bassingbourn, Cambs.

The "black" tie was probably OD (and oh yes, that's a sergeant wearing it). The grommets in caps - probably a fetish of that particular command. Still can't explain the B-3 collars on A-2s. Old B-3s typically went to groundcrews. There must have been a few junkers around.

The 91st BG website has the 2nd pic with the following notation:

Back Row - Left to Right:
S/Sgt. John H. Coomes, New Haven, Conn. Waist Gunner; S/Sgt. Harvey G. Landis, Williamson, W. Va., Ball Turret Gunner; S/Sgt. Michael D. White, Mexia, Texas, Waist Gunner, Killed in action; T/Sgt. Robert Lovely, Springboro, Ohio, Engineer/Top turret Gunner; S/Sgt. Melvin (Joe) Penner, Beatrice, Neb., Tail Gunner; T/Sgt. Morris Weston, Los Angeles, Ca. Radio Operator.

Front Row - Left to Right:
1st Lt. John J. Boyce, Milton, Mass., Pilot; 2nd Lt. H.J. Kennady, Detroit, Mich., Bombardier, Killed in action; 2nd Lt. Thomas E. Johnson, Memphis, Tenn., Co-Pilot; 2nd Lt. William Keyser, Barnesville, Ohio, Navigator.

The photo was taken on January 3, 1944.

 

[John Lever]

Found one -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Genuine-WW2-A-2-B ... 1|294%3A50

 

[Roughwear]

Found one -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Genuine-WW2-A-2-B ... 1|294%3A50

Yes, but its not a collar from a B3, unless its been cut down to fit the A2's original leather collar.

 

[John Lever]

Found one -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Genuine-WW2-A-2-B ... 1|294%3A50

Yes, but its not a collar from a B3, unless its been cut down to fit the A2's original leather collar.

Andrew, you're so strict !

 

[Andrew]

Found one -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Genuine-WW2-A-2-B ... 1|294%3A50

Yes, but its not a collar from a B3, unless its been cut down to fit the A2's original leather collar.

Andrew, you're so strict !

This collar actually looks like it's off an Irvin.

The website he points to in the auction is excellent. The crew and inflight photos from the Zemper collection are really outstanding. I can't see the one he refers to unless it's the shot of the Bombadier from behind, but you can't see enough detail in that.

http://www.457thbombgroup.org/zemper/PagePersonnel.html

The jackets Tim posted were possibly worn by Waist Gunners in exposed positions (B-6 helmet) and as Miles suggested the collar was a scarf substitute.

 

[Chandler]

I think it's funny that the far right front officer in the pic has a rain cover on his hat -- bet that caused him some ribbing!

Chandler

 

[zoomer]

Maybe it was a brand new hat and he didn't want to f it up until he had to!

Maybe the 322nd had a thing about not wearing the dress cap in flight. A couple of others are grommeted.