Rotenhahn deactivated

Discussion in '**ANNOUNCEMENTS**' started by bfrench, Jan 1, 2012.

  1. bfrench

    bfrench Administrator

    Messages:
    832
    Location:
    Niagara Falls, Canada
    Day 1 of the new year 2012

    Rotenhanh - decativated by me - after repeated transgressions against the basic policy of this forum to keep this a place of informational conversational about vintage leather jackets and its bretheren, nylon jackets, his membership will no longer be accepted by the Vintage Leather Jackets forum.

    As you all know you are guests here and as guests you are expected to follow the rules of the house.

    What I have decided to do is allow open discussion of my actions since I am sure some of you may think I'm being draconian by doing this and some of you may think it is long overdue.

    I'm not going to get involved in the discussion, I'm not seeking any kind of approval, I'm just giving everyone a place to vent.

    Nothing is going to change on my end, so have at it.
     
  2. omarco

    omarco Member

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    Location:
    hampshire countryside
    shame :(
     
  3. Persimmon

    Persimmon Member

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    Location:
    Nottingham England
    If you have deactivated his membership does that mean Jeff can no longer even read this series of Posts in his defence or his not ?

    I have to say that I enjoyed his posts in the main and it sometimes brought life to an often on occasion less than stimulating Forum.

    Personally I think the action is petty and extremely sad.
    As for being overdue - I do not agree in the slightest.

    Perhaps you will blame the thread of Litigation in this oh so sensitive world some people seem to be living in.
    Really I ask you !!!!!!!!!!

    Sorry but I don't think its a shame as mentioned in the previous post.
    I would rather say ....shame on you for doing it and especially for stating so clearly that no matter what is said pro or against you will not change your mind on the subject.

    I have to say that the title of the posting leaves me with a sour taste in the month.
    "Rotenhahn deactivated"

    Surely that should at least say Rotenhahn's membership deactivated..... or is that your real thoughts ???

    (Maybe these comments will mean I will be deactivated next. I hope not but.....)
     
  4. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Well-Known Member

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    2,000
    back a coupla hundred years ago or so, a fella wrote: "i may not agree with what you have to say, but i will defend with my life, your right to say it".
     
  5. John Lever

    John Lever Moderator

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    Location:
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    I can understand why you did it as he did get carried away sometimes, and I rarely agreed with his strong views ... but I think it is a shame as he really is very passionate about jackets. If only he knew when to stop ?
     
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    He did go off the deep end quite often, however no one was forced to read or comment on his posts.
     
  7. Clark J

    Clark J Active Member

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    Location:
    Minnesota
    Not cool Bill!!Who's next???Those next kangaroo huggin dudes??Yah that's right Andrew,,,got my eye on you!!!........
    (They have them down there don't they??)
     
  8. Cobblers161

    Cobblers161 Well-Known Member

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    Location:
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    My first thought is wow! What happened on the war thread?

    Love jeff's passion for jackets hate his adoration of the German war machine. He's passionate and shoots from the hip and whether we like what he has to say or not I felt he was an integral part of the forum and was more than pleased to see him return.

    We're all grown up(-ish) now if we don't like something we can just ignore it.

    I reckon reinstate him! Go Jeff, you're nuts but we love you!
     
  9. a2jacketpatches

    a2jacketpatches Active Member

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    3,137
    Location:
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    I agree with most comments this guy, a little abrasive but all we do have the right to speak our mind and the choice to ignore, live and let live. However, I did find myself wondering what this latest thread had to do with vintage leather, nylon, or any other type of jacket.
     
  10. unclegrumpy

    unclegrumpy Active Member

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    1,377
    One thing that many of you may not fully appreciate is the amount of time and work it takes to keep a Forum up. There are daily attacks...sometimes hundreds a day.....from Russian, Romanian, and other robo hackers trying to sneak onto the site and post porn, steal your information, or just corrupt the site. And, that is just the tip of the iceberg.

    It appears to me from Bill's statement, that there had probably been some behind scenes discussions and possible warnings that we were not party to. His frustration with this situation is obvious, and if his warnings as moderator were repeatedly ignored, then what choice did he really have?
     
  11. ButteMT61

    ButteMT61 Well-Known Member

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    2,428
    Location:
    Pasadena, CA USA
    Being new, I don't count much, but I'm not new to this type of action. I also was part of the last thread (on Germany/WWII) so I think I feel compelled...

    First and foremost - this site/forum is a business. The owners have every right and probably justification to edit and moderate as fits their needs. I for one don't "get offended". That is in fact, one of my biggest 21st century peeves.
    Problem is, so many in society today get offended at every little thing, and a business can't afford to be associated with things that many in society find distasteful. It's a sad fact of life that "freedom" - especially of speech, is really something different than it once was. To that end, anyone here can start their own website/forum and let people post what they like if the rules here (or anywhere) are not to their liking. Freedom of speech is not someone else's responsibility to provide for you (us).

    As for people being banned/suspended, I've never seen that happen (or had to do it when I was a mod) unless someone had numerous trips to the principal's office. And if a place is that quick to ban, I leave it. I too love heated debate, etc.

    The title of the post. Some find that offensive - I don't. It's better than numerous threads popping up and rumors, etc. While our words may not effect the outcomes, I give credit for this thread being here - that is something I've never seen in 20+ years online participating in some form of discussions.
    I was in the last thread, and I being new, was a little surprised at the statements made. I reenact and know lots of "Germans" who not only reenact, but have personal beliefs not far from their fantasy roles. It repulses me. But there's only three things one can do - ignore them, engage them, or get into a fight with them. Maybe some time ago I'd have chosen the last option, but today, I generally do one of the first two, depending on who it is and the situation.

    In the end, someone talking like that has to know there are few places that will tolerate it. Is that good or bad? Dunno. I like open discussion on just about anything, but these guys have every right to not let it be posted here. I guess I'm lucky I wasn't also included in the suspension. Sorry, being new, I don't want to look like a smartass, but since I'm here, I thought I'd say something.

    Happy New Year (said with slight hangover)
     
  12. JDAM

    JDAM Member

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    487
    Isn't the statutory age for retirement 65?

    Really, I was unaware this site was a business?
     
  13. omarco

    omarco Member

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    505
    Location:
    hampshire countryside
    i wish i had seen the WWII thread, sounds fun :D
     
  14. ButteMT61

    ButteMT61 Well-Known Member

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    2,428
    Location:
    Pasadena, CA USA
    That's the problem, it is. Maybe not in the traditional sense like Best Buy, but business nonetheless. Just try it out and see for yourself.
     
  15. Grant

    Grant Well-Known Member

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    895
    Rotenhahn's posts whether you agreed with them or not made you stop and think for a moment. His anal-retentive insights on jackets were painfully dead on. Censoring someone like him will lead to conformity and mediocrity. I couldn't disagree with Bill more on this. Suddenly 2012 feels like 1984. Happy New Year!
     
  16. CBI

    CBI Well-Known Member

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    3,476
    Bill - thanks for doing this. I seem to be in the minority here. His posts were frequently OTT and pretty aggressive. As stated, I am sure there were/are other issues. A few years back we had the same issues with him. Agreed, this is a business of sorts and you have to keep it going and the Mods have to look at the practical aspects of running it as well (that we as readers don't see).

    A lot of guys seem to like his "tone" and I don't think that speaks highly of some of the forum membership however everyone is chiming in/has their likes/dislikes and has their own views. As much as a I like VLJ, over half the time I read andI say to myself, "these are JUST jackets"....................
     
  17. deeb7

    deeb7 New Member

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    5,554
    Location:
    Auckland, New Zealand
    I agree, I think the departure of Jeff is a great loss to the forum ... one of only a few with that degree of knowledge, and observation, that helped the rest of us to learn.
     
  18. Jason

    Jason Member

    Messages:
    728
    Location:
    Tasmania, Australia
    I must have missed / mentally filtered out all Jeffs controversial postings (perhaps having a daughter who is constantly obsessed with conspiracy theories does that to one's mind), but know that I will miss his OCD-fuelled eye for detail when it came to jackets. That said, sounds like he was warned, several times... what other outcome could be expected?
     
  19. MikeyB-17

    MikeyB-17 Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Cornwall, UK
    I'm sorry if Jeff's been banned-I was quite pleased to see him back. He was a bit too much of an admirer of the Third Reich for my tastes (although he's not the first to say the Nazis had cool uniforms or had good generals-and that alone does not make necessarily make him a Nazi sympathiser) and he didn't pull his punches, but he knew a lot about jackets, especially Roughwears, and he was dead right about manufacturers not doing enough to get the little details right on their jackets, as John Chapman was to prove. He also made the place a bit more interesting.
    I don't, however, know what went on in the background to bring about this decision, and didn't catch the last throes of the offending thread. Being a Mod and running the forum isn't an easy job I would imagine, and Mods sometimes have other things to worry about than the views of the membership. It's a shame he's gone, but as I don't know the full facts I'm not going to condemn the decision.
     
  20. Rutger

    Rutger Active Member

    Messages:
    1,295
    Location:
    Hengelo, Netherlands
    :( decision.

    Rottenman is like a column writer : exaggarated, provocative, but most certainly not brainless.
    Short fused, sometimes kamikaze like, over the edge, not always consequential.
    Shake your head, read between the lines and get on with life, right?
    If you leave the forum because of him, you probably have taken him too seriously.

    However, by becoming a member, one agrees with the conditions and accepts beforehand the actions of the Great Leaders ;), which rottenman was well aware of.
    If you don't like it, start your own forum.

    BTW, have yourselves a healthy and happy 2012.
     

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